Comments on: In Search of the Mythical Afro-Argentine http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/ Buenos Aires, City of Faded Elegance Mon, 06 Feb 2012 14:58:34 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Jeff http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/comment-page-1/#comment-108700 Jeff Fri, 23 Sep 2011 16:54:46 +0000 http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/#comment-108700 HI Daniel, thanks for your comments. Good insights. Excellent point about the possibility of African-Argentines not self-identifying themselves as such on census records due to a possible stigma. And I think you're absolutely right about keeping the population ratio in perspective due to the rapid population boom after 1880 with European immigrants. HI Daniel, thanks for your comments. Good insights. Excellent point about the possibility of African-Argentines not self-identifying themselves as such on census records due to a possible stigma. And I think you’re absolutely right about keeping the population ratio in perspective due to the rapid population boom after 1880 with European immigrants.

]]> By: Daniel http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/comment-page-1/#comment-108682 Daniel Thu, 22 Sep 2011 21:22:49 +0000 http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/#comment-108682 I'll explain that about the census. The reason we know that one third of the city was black was from the census of 1851 or thereabouts. And we know that the numbers declined rapidly from the census figures, so we can summise that people weren't telling the truth about their ethnicity. But more importantly was the population increase in the late 1800s and early 1900s. When the blacks made up one third, the population of the city was say, 50,000, so 16,000 blacks. But when the population swelled with 1 million European immigrants, the blacks accounted for 1.5% per cent of the population. Add in intermarriage, war and disease. My argument's all over the place I know, but you get the gist. I’ll explain that about the census. The reason we know that one third of the city was black was from the census of 1851 or thereabouts. And we know that the numbers declined rapidly from the census figures, so we can summise that people weren’t telling the truth about their ethnicity. But more importantly was the population increase in the late 1800s and early 1900s. When the blacks made up one third, the population of the city was say, 50,000, so 16,000 blacks. But when the population swelled with 1 million European immigrants, the blacks accounted for 1.5% per cent of the population. Add in intermarriage, war and disease. My argument’s all over the place I know, but you get the gist.

]]> By: Daniel http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/comment-page-1/#comment-108681 Daniel Thu, 22 Sep 2011 21:14:49 +0000 http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/#comment-108681 I'm a bit late commenting here. There's a book by Pilar González Bernaldo de Quirós called Civilidad y política en los orígenes de la nación argentina. I translated it about 7 years go so my memory isn't great. There's a lengthy chapter on Afro-Argentines. González says that the yellow fever and wars weren't the reason the blakcs disappeared, although many emancipated slaves loyal to Rosas (who had emancipated them) died in the civil war. She says it was through intermarriage and, if my memory isn't shot to pieces, people saying on the census that they were white, instead of mulatto or black, because of the stigma. I have a copy here in Buenos Aires if anyone wants to borrow. There has been much immigration from Africa in recent years, from what I've heard mostly Cabo Verde, Nigeria, Cameroon, and also blacks from other Latin American countries. I’m a bit late commenting here. There’s a book by Pilar González Bernaldo de Quirós called Civilidad y política en los orígenes de la nación argentina. I translated it about 7 years go so my memory isn’t great. There’s a lengthy chapter on Afro-Argentines. González says that the yellow fever and wars weren’t the reason the blakcs disappeared, although many emancipated slaves loyal to Rosas (who had emancipated them) died in the civil war. She says it was through intermarriage and, if my memory isn’t shot to pieces, people saying on the census that they were white, instead of mulatto or black, because of the stigma. I have a copy here in Buenos Aires if anyone wants to borrow.
There has been much immigration from Africa in recent years, from what I’ve heard mostly Cabo Verde, Nigeria, Cameroon, and also blacks from other Latin American countries.

]]> By: Santaj http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/comment-page-1/#comment-107646 Santaj Sun, 01 May 2011 21:54:47 +0000 http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/#comment-107646 I just saw a report on Al-jazeera today on Linktv about the Afro-Argentines. They are a hidden community that is very proud of their African past. They will specify themselves as African which I believe was not allowed in the past. I just saw a report on Al-jazeera today on Linktv about the Afro-Argentines. They are a hidden community that is very proud of their African past. They will specify themselves as African which I believe was not allowed in the past.

]]> By: Bernardino Rivadavia http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/comment-page-1/#comment-96516 Bernardino Rivadavia Mon, 30 Jun 2008 14:47:57 +0000 http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/#comment-96516 Yes Anonymous, post your pic and address. Yes Anonymous, post your pic and address.

]]> By: anonymous http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/comment-page-1/#comment-94901 anonymous Wed, 25 Jun 2008 03:22:42 +0000 http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/#comment-94901 Wow, that last sentence of yours is incredibly racist. You obviously realized that, too, or you wouldn’t hide behind an anonymous identity. do u want me to post a pic or my adress? its not racist its true sad but true Wow, that last sentence of yours is incredibly racist. You obviously realized that, too, or you wouldn’t hide behind an anonymous identity.
do u want me to post a pic or my adress? its not racist its true sad but true

]]> By: Jeff http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/comment-page-1/#comment-94882 Jeff Wed, 25 Jun 2008 02:30:19 +0000 http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/#comment-94882 Anonymous: Wow, that last sentence of yours is incredibly racist. You obviously realized that, too, or you wouldn't hide behind an anonymous identity. Anonymous:

Wow, that last sentence of yours is incredibly racist. You obviously realized that, too, or you wouldn’t hide behind an anonymous identity.

]]> By: anonymous http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/comment-page-1/#comment-94870 anonymous Wed, 25 Jun 2008 01:56:57 +0000 http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/#comment-94870 Furthermore, Afro-Argentines died disproportionately in the regional wars because they were promised their freedom in return funny fact slavery was abolished as soon as the constitution was made (181something) so they were free at that time :) stop writing bullshit like you know something about my country we have racism because dark skninned people tend to commit more crimes than white people (not only in argentina but the whole world ) Furthermore, Afro-Argentines died disproportionately in the regional wars because they were promised their freedom in return
funny fact slavery was abolished as soon as the constitution was made (181something) so they were free at that time :) stop writing bullshit like you know something about my country
we have racism because dark skninned people tend to commit more crimes than white people (not only in argentina but the whole world )

]]> By: Jeff http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/comment-page-1/#comment-27564 Jeff Tue, 24 Apr 2007 02:26:26 +0000 http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/#comment-27564 Hi Anonymous, Thanks for the comment. Yes, I do believe that the part about the military deaths is accurate. But I'm still not convinced that yellow fever was a significant event in the demise of the black population in Buenos Aires. Quarantining yellow fever patients in the black quarters would not necessarily have led to an increase in yellow fever among blacks since yellow fever is not transmitted from person to person. Yet, it is conceivable that mosquitoes carried the infection from sick patients to healthy blacks. Regardless, since it was accepted belief at the time that yellow fever was transmitted from person to person then it was truly a very insidious tactic to quarantine the sick patients in black quarters. I certainly don't doubt the truth of that statement since cruel quarantines (of various nature) were widely enacted in many cities with yellow fever outbreaks. Do you have a citation to document that yellow fever victims were quarantined in the black quarters in Buenos Aires? I'm just interested in reading whatever is written on this topic. Thanks! Hi Anonymous,

Thanks for the comment. Yes, I do believe that the part about the military deaths is accurate.

But I’m still not convinced that yellow fever was a significant event in the demise of the black population in Buenos Aires. Quarantining yellow fever patients in the black quarters would not necessarily have led to an increase in yellow fever among blacks since yellow fever is not transmitted from person to person. Yet, it is conceivable that mosquitoes carried the infection from sick patients to healthy blacks.

Regardless, since it was accepted belief at the time that yellow fever was transmitted from person to person then it was truly a very insidious tactic to quarantine the sick patients in black quarters. I certainly don’t doubt the truth of that statement since cruel quarantines (of various nature) were widely enacted in many cities with yellow fever outbreaks.

Do you have a citation to document that yellow fever victims were quarantined in the black quarters in Buenos Aires? I’m just interested in reading whatever is written on this topic. Thanks!

]]> By: Anonymous http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/comment-page-1/#comment-27562 Anonymous Tue, 24 Apr 2007 01:54:55 +0000 http://baires.elsur.org/archives/in-search-of-the-mythical-afro-argentine/#comment-27562 Actually, the Clarin theory is accurate. The part of the story that was omitted is that persons with yellow fever were often quarantined in the black quarters which, as the UNESCO document accurately states, were created "as a means of social control of the colored population." Furthermore, Afro-Argentines died disproportionately in the regional wars because they were promised their freedom in return, yet they were often used as cannon fodder and placed in the most dangerous situations which lead to mass annihilation. Actually, the Clarin theory is accurate. The part of the story that was omitted is that persons with yellow fever were often quarantined in the black quarters which, as the UNESCO document accurately states, were created “as a means of social control of the colored population.” Furthermore, Afro-Argentines died disproportionately in the regional wars because they were promised their freedom in return, yet they were often used as cannon fodder and placed in the most dangerous situations which lead to mass annihilation.

]]>